107 thoughts on ““Geloofsprong” – Johann die Paaivreter”
I think many Jews lost their faith during WW2. Suppose Johannie would expect of them to do the “geloofsprong” again.
What I find interesting about some of my Jewish friends, is that many of them are technically atheists. However, they still adhere to the habits and culture of Judaism. Almost like belonging to an exclusive club.
Unfortunately I live right next door to a fundie arsehole. He has a big white handlebar moustache. This old toppie sticks his nose wherever it isn’t wanted, which is – everywhere. His wife is a full time Jesus worshipping “housewife” and specialises in vicious gossip. They carry on like they are street police, monitoring everyone elses doings and screwings. The wife likes to stand at the neighbour’s fence across the road gossiping with that neighbour’s wife, so they can have a good view of what everyone else is doing, and glare at people when they enter their driveways as if they have something on them. She pretends she goes on walks and only bumps into the neighbours when they just happen to be in their front gardens. Whenever she sees me turn into my driveway she scuttles away from the neighbour’s fence, bolts down the road, crosses it, and pretends to be on a walk back towards her own house as I take my groceries out of the boot.
Jo! Jo! Daai video, hy’s baie kak! Deel ons regtig die planet met sulke goed. Dit was verskriklik, terrible, horrible, nasty, kak, stront, fucked up, aaklig, stupid, ontalentvol! John Lennon draai in sy graf om!
Ja hulle het gewoonlik swak smaak ( Hierdie klomp happy clappys ). Ek onthou toe Poena is koning uitgekom het, het ds. Jannie Pelser dit gaan kyk. Hy was blykbaar baie erg geskok gewees! Nou vra ek myself af, was hy so uiters naief om te dink hy gaan nou na ‘n lekker familie film kyk? Meeste Afrikaanse films is ‘n klomp commin gemors! Is Jannie bitter naief, is hy commin of het hy doelbewus vir kak gaan soek?
What else these Hans Drol wankers get up to. If I were an Afrikaner I would moer these paaivreter konte for making Afrikaners look kak. Break his fingers and shove the drumsticks up his arse.
What actually is the definition of a “Paaivreter”? Ek weet Johann is ‘n imbesiel maar is alle imbesiele “paaivreters” of is alle “paaivreters” imbesiele? (Nou het ek myself in ‘n knoop.)
Johann-Paaivreter, help asseblief en vertel my wat jy is.
Toe ek op laerskool was het my een vriend se pa die woord paaivreter gebruik vir mense wat hy nie van gehou het nie. Ons het nooit geweet wat presies dit beteken het nie. Maar ons het beslis geweet dit is in lyn met poepol en drol. Johann is beslis ‘n paaivreter.
Waar is DJ paaivreter? Why isn’t he in the house? Het ons dalk sy gees uiteindelik gebreek? Het ons actually die laaste se gese? Ek het nooit gedog die dag sal kom dat Johann nie meer met ons is nie.
Ek het nou uiteindelik die video’s gesien en ja ek stem sam dat hulle eerder moet acid en zoll rook dat hulle ook soos julle “verlig” kan word. Kyk nou net hoe goeie voorbeeld stel die Antwoord vir die kinders, baie beter as Sondag skool!
Inane chewing of gum plus premature beerbelly makes the lead “dancer” look like a pregnant goat. Silly little girls chewing wads of gum look like geitlammetjies. Too much beer, fatty meat and koeksisters makes the boerewors belt 20kg overweight by the age of 35, at latest.They have meetings for the ladies on “innerlike skoonheid” as well as “uiterlike skoonheid” but this does not seem to apply to the menfolk.
Ek het die Ateis sprong gemaak! Ek wonder hoeveel van vandag se sogenaamde ” Jesus freaks ” se tipe sou actually 2000 jaar terug geskree het ” Kruisig hom! ” Mcbrolloks ek like jou site moerse! Maar ek is bevrees dat die folklore van geslag tot geslag oorgedra word. Minipulation of young minds! Ek onthou toe ek klein was het my ouers my maak my kerk klere aantrek en ‘n foto van my geneem voor kerk. My pa het gedreig dat hy my sal klap as ek nie ophou huil nie. Vandag is ek ‘n grootmens met depressie en ek is ‘n totale right off. Die monstrosity van religion leef voort. Ek haat my fokken pa! Hy het alhoewel ook volwasse geword met die tyd heen en ek wonder of hy self nog glo aan daai fokken bullshit. Fuck all religious people, long live atheists!!!! O gaan kyk ‘n bietjie na Pat Condell op youtube. Malherbe vir jou wil ek se, aangesien jy nog klein kindertjies het, luister na jou kinders! As iets hulle pla praat met hulle daaroor. Moenie dink – Dit is nou maar net ‘n kind, hy moet met sy karretjies daar buite gaan speel en sy bek hou. Dis wat my ouers gedoen het en kyk watter fokop is ek vandag. Kinders het ook gevoelens! Alhoewel dit vir sekere mense bitter moeilik is om te verstaan.
Adriaan I suspect you have an IQ in the upper stratosphere which makes you impermeable to bullshit. People with built in integrity get depressed because they don’t understand that not everybody else is on their level. Try to associate with people who are at least as bright as you, because the other direction doesn’t work for you.
Adriaan ek het voorheen vir jou vertel dat die stressor in jou lewe is jou Pa en dis nie die fisiese pa daar buite nie, dis die psigise “pa” in jou kop, kyk daarna en kyk waar kom jou gedagtes vandaan, en dan “herskep” jy jou wêreld sonder al die sjt wat jy daarin gesit het.
En vir al julle musiek kritici, kan ons ander dalk julle “video’s” sien asb. Of wat van julle lirieke, wys tog net dat julle nie net op die kantlyn staan en kritiseer nie, maar dat julle “weet’ waarvan julle praat!
En ek dog paai is 3.142. . . . .∞ en dat julle eerder paai vreters is. . .maar dit wys my ook dat daar dinge in jou jeug gebeur wat jy saamdra na jou volwasse lewe, daars is ‘n woord daarvoor. .iets soos “tranference” (Eric Berne dink ek – road less traveled)
Dit wat gewerk het toe jy ‘n kind was sal nie noodwendig werk as jy volwasse is nie. En dis duidelik dat Mad Mac en Adriaan hul “jeug” nog saam met hulle dra.
Maar Molly laat ons jou musiek hoor, en as jy nog daai “rokspaaider” en rooinek stryd in jou dra kan ons daaroor praat, ek weet die kween (fossiel) aanhangers het ‘n probleem met hul eie waardigheid, veral as hulle met die europeen in kontak kom.
En die paai in paaivreter tref my nou eers, dit verwys natuurlik na vroulike anatomie, en vandag ken ons dit sommer net as BJ. So die “vriend se pa” wou graag heimlik daai paai gevreet het, maar hy kon nie die moed bymekaar skraap om dit te doen nie, toe reageer hy teenoor sy begeerte net soos julle teenoor die geloofspring doen!
Johann, ek het my pel self gevra wat die woord beteken. Dit was sy pa wat dit baie gebruik het. Hier is sy verduideliking:
“Hey Mack, ‘n “paaivreter” is die naam wat die manne op die myne in Rustenburg gebruik het vir iemand wat “kak sleg” of “useless” was. En as jy in RSA gebly in die ’80 sal jy ook presies verstaan as ek jou verduidelik waar dit vandaan kom. In die tyd was daar in elke woonwyk ‘n “café” (Die kaffee op die hoek) en elke “café” het ‘n verwarmde rak met glas deure gehad wat altyd vol met Pie’s was (Meestal was dit ‘n Griek se kaffee en die het altyd pie’s verkoop) Nou die “paaivreters” was die mense wat te kak sleg was om te kook en te useless om te spaar vir ‘n keer na ‘n egte restaurant te gaan, dus dan gaan koop hulle pie’s by die Griek!”
Ja Mac, en dan het hy boonop ‘n “dirty mind”. Hy maak onmiddelik ‘n seksuele konneksie. Wonder of sy liewe jessussie hiervan sal hou. Ek meen, seks is so taboe onder die godiote dat hulle nie kan glo jesussie is die resultaat van ‘n doodnormale seksdaad nie. Siek spulletjie, die paaivreters.
Ha ha, remmeber that old crack about the difference between a King Pie and a condom? Condom has more meat in it. You get better pies and microwave meals at PnP these days. Single guys buy that stuff. What hasn’t changed since the eighties is that South African men refuse to cook dinner. Eating alone in a restaurant reeks of desperation. Saffer guys only eat in restaurants if they can organise a date who is expected to pay in kind.
Hi McBrollocks and all the other folks,
I can’t remember if I ever posted any comments on this blog. I did partake in the debates on Nathan Bond’s Tart remarks for a number of years. (McBrollocks and Savage you will probably remember)
I am a fully blown proud and happy atheist. Been so since the age of 18.
I also had a horrid childhood as a result of being the youngest in a sick, god-struck family of eight children. Poverty, almost daily beatings, non-stop preaching and bible-down-your-throat shit. I am happy to say that I worked through most of the craziness, with help, by getting in touch with severely suppressed feelings and emotions, and being able to express them fully, through deep crying, massive anger and other emotions.
It’s been over thirty years of continuous growing. I would like to post on this blog from time to time. I have gained deep insights into the human condition.
I know today that, as Malherbe hinted, that people grab onto a belief system because they had suffered as babies, toddlers, teenagers, even whilst in the womb……… and many still do, as fully grown adults.
Belief in a god, a deity or any unearthly or supernatural being, is a coping mechanism, a crutch, a defence mechanism, just as any other act-out like alcohol, smoking, drugs, crime or whatever, that prevents one from becoming aware of the real trauma and suffering that took place. Denial becomes the
sine qua non: “I am so happy in jesus…..” etc.
Because the coping mechanism or act-out is working, many believers/alcoholics/smokers/workaholics/talk-aholics/overeaters/criminals/sex addicts/all other addicts…. will be unaware of their traumatic childhood. After all, can anyone be expected to remember what had happened to them during gestation, or as a tiny baby, without being in a program that has been developed to do just that?
The body remembers all… and every painful traumatic experience such as not having had one’s needs met, i.e. not being held, loved, caressed, fed when hungry, not being allowed to cry, scream, get angry, to sass, to play, to run, to express ideas or opinions…. remains in our being for life, unless we have the opportunity as adults to go back to those painful moments, and expel the pain once again through the emotions.
Many, from infancy to teenage years, still get physically slapped or beaten, suppressed, told to stop crying, etc.
Dis nou genoeg vir eers..
P.S. ….. If abortion is murder, then a blowjob must be cannibalism…?
Long time brother!!!! Welcome! You are a fresh new voice here. You can probably smell the tang of shit the fundies always leave where ever they go. We have some peaches here all right. Or to be more precise, bloody trolls!
I do have a question about cannibalism. If a chef makes a salad, and rasps carrots into the salad, and accidentally slices some of his skin and flesh off and that ends up in the salad, can one consider it cannibalism if someone eats that salad?
When dining with cannibals, never eat the onion rings!
Hi Verifanie. Yes, remember you from Nathan’s blog. Really enjou ConTester’s sharp wit and incredible knowledge and insight. Theck out the godiots on this blog. Everywhere equally braindead.
Thanks for the welcome folks,
My contention is that it is not only a belief in a god or gods or deities that can be considered crazy or in fact insane. It is, in my opinion, any and all beliefs and ideas i.e. aliens, astrology, tarot cards, supernatural powers, scientology,
magic, voodoo, fortune telling, and the list goes on forever. McBrollocks, this blog could actually be expanded to discuss all ideations and craziness. There is little difference between one who is an alcoholic and one who is obhsessed with his or her gods…..
All of this is a clear sign that humans are ill. Suffering from childhoods that allowed no freedom of expression of fears, tears, pain, thought and opinions,
not having been allowed to cry their little hearts out, which is a feature that evolution endowed us with, to heal us and remove the pain, and that has been sadly suppressed for perhaps thousands of years.
We, most of us today,did not grow up free. When we cried, we were shushed and shaken, talked to, (“ooh, look at the moon”) etc., or were simply told that
we will be “given something to cry about”. We were sent to schools where the teachers, most of them also suffering from this universal neurosis, screamed at us, insulted us, beat us, while we were forced to sit for hours on end listening to headshit that was forced down our throats. No fucking wonder that
“jesus is so sweet and kind and will never hurt us” etc.
If only everyone could start by reading let’s say, a book titled Summerhill, by A.S. Neill. , or Problem Parents, not Problem Children. , or Freedom, not Licence. Also any one of Arthur Janov’s works, numbering 16 books by now, the first one being The Primal Scream, from 1969.
McBrollocks.. er..yes, the tang of shit hangs widely over most of this fucked up planet. I do admit that religious shit smells deeper, darker, and worse than most others’
Malherbe yes, ole Con-tester is the smart one. High intelligence and sharp wit. He never seems to tire from posting on Nathan’s blog. I wonder why Nathan hasn’t posted anything new in a very long time. Perhaps too busy, now that he seems to be leaning in the direction of politics?
Now and then I google “Atheist comedians” for a good laugh. It is surprising how many there are. I think most comedians are atheists. Here’s a real beauty:
“You know, everyone wears these crosses around their necks, waiting for jesus to come back to earth. Does anyone think that when he arrives here, that he will want to see a cross again?”
Ha ha. Good point. A really excellent atheist comedian is Aussie Tim Minchen. The guy is super talented: excellent pianist, comedian, songwriter and on top of it a BsC graduate. Really hilarious. Google the piece “Storm” on youtube – my favourite.
Haai ouens en meisies,
Hier is vir julle almal ‘n artikel om aan te peusel, wat vir ons almal duidelik bewys hoe sg. “heilige, gotsvresende, gristene” ‘n arme jong dogtertjie se lewe kan opfok vir altyd. Die kerk, haar ouers, pastore en almal om haar is/was
ernstig skuldig aan die gruweldade wat aan haar gepleeg is.
Ja dis ‘n tipiese Afrikaner opvoedingspraktyk. Kinders mag nie teepraat nie, hulle moet maar net alles verdra! Grootmense is mos altyd reg. Ek kan nie glo watter klomp lafhaarts die Afrikaner is nie. Tipiese ” Oom by die kerk”. Hierdie klomp christene is ‘n klomp vieslikke goed! Hulle irriteer my verskriklik! Die ergste van die ergste is nie dominees nie maar pastore. Dat daai ouens so baie geld maak uit bullshit praat uit kan ek nie glo nie. Leuens wat mense ryk maak. Miskien moet ek self so ‘n ou praktytjie oopmaak. Daai ouens is in anyway net so min heilig as ek.
Adriaan, toe ek ‘n jong laaitie was, hier in die vyftigs en vroee sestigs, was daar ouens in die AGS kerk wie later, d.m.v. die destydse AGS kollege pastore geword het. Jy kon die kollege bywoon met net ‘n standerd agt geleerdheid. Daar was gerugte dat van hulle slegs std. ses gehad het, maar dit kan ek nie bevestig nie.
My suster se swaer, wie ook een van hierdie simpele pastore was, het haar eendag in haar eie huis verkrag. As gevolg van die vrees wat in ons ingebliksem was as kinders, het sy dit nooit aan iemand genoem nie, tot so vier jaar gelede. Hy het intussen gevrek. Ons was agt kinders. Ek is die enigste een wie my geheel en al onttrek het van al die kranksinnigheid, die leuens, die onderdrukking van idees en gevoelens, ens. Die res, die oorledenes en die wie nog leef, is en was “happy-clappy” opgefoktes, tot hul dood, en tot vandag toe nog.
Ek onthou die AGS kerk as ‘n plek waar daar histeriese dienste gehou was. Mense het begin om so ‘n klomp kak te skree (tale praat), neergedonder,
(heilige gees gevang) ens. Dit was skrikwekkend vir ‘n jong kind om te aanskou.
A nurse bandages a victim’s left leg in a hospital in Accra on May 19, others injured in a stampede at a church in the Ghanaian capital, police say.
On Sunday, the incident took place at famous church in Accra, where thousands of worshippers had gathered for an offer of anointing water they believe can cure illnesses.
“In trying to get it, a stampede happened,” police spokesman Freeman Tetty said, adding, “Four are confirmed dead, and 30 are injured, some in critical condition.”
Tetty also said an investigation was underway to determine the cause of the accident.
One of those injured in the stampede said, “People from the back, they pushed… and they fell on us. So we were battered by a lot of forces.”
Reverend Sam McCaanan said later on a local radio station that the plan to offer the water had been canceled.
“We are devastated, it is very unfortunate, and we are very sorry,” McCaanan said.
. . .”My contention is that it is not only a belief in a god or gods or deities that can be considered crazy or in fact insane. It is, in my opinion, any and all beliefs and ideas” Dis nou Broer Fanie se skrywe laank terug, nou het ek net gewonder Broer fanie glo jy “dit”?
Is dit nou ‘n “idee” of is dit ‘n stelling wat jy “glo”. . .? “all beliefs and ideas” y skiet ‘n bietjie wyd ou.
Johann,
Nouja, waar begin ek….. Eerstens, is dit nie net myns insiens nie , maar ook die van vele ander ernstige denkers, navorsers, wetenskaplikes en dies meer. Jy moet net ‘n bietjie wyer lees, soos bv. van James Randi daar in Amerika.
Hy het al vir jarre lank ‘n prys van een miljoen dollar aan enigiemand wie kan bewys dat enige van die esoteriese kak waaraan mense glo, waar is,
Tot vandag toe, het niemand nog ooit die prys gewen nie. Het jy dalk enige wetenskaplike bewyse dat enige van hierdie wensdenkery waar is?
Ons as menslike diere, is die enigste weses op aarde wie verbeeldingskragte het. Dit is a.g.v. die feit dat ons ‘n neo-cortex ontwikkel het. Dit is ons derde brein, en die heel jongste in terme van die tydperk van evolusionele vooruitgang. Ons oudste brein is die viscera, die oer-brein, of reptiel-brein, soos jy sal vind in visse, krokodille, ens. Daarna het die limbiese stelsel gekom. Dit is die emosionele brein, die kern van ons gevoelens en emosies.
Hierdie twee breine is honderde miljoene jare ouer as die neo-cortex. Aldrie die breine is tot vandag nog in ons skedels.
Ons as menslike wesens, het begin dink a.g.v. ons neo-cortex. Ons het begin wonder oor dinge. Ons het idees ontwikkel, soos bv. dat daar gode is, en dat hulle ons seen en straf, soos dinge beter en slegter gaan met ons. Idees.
Diere het nie idees nie, net ons as mense. Hulle glo nie in gode of enige ander van die kak wat ons tot dusver uitgedroom het oor die sowat honderd duisend jaar wat ons die neo-cortex het nie.
What we know today is that our intellect, or neo-cortex, has what is called a “gating” mechanism. It puts out a blocking system or “gates” that prevent extraordinary pain or trauma from reaching our consciousness, that has the power to kill us. Once the pain is blocked, the neo-cortex keeps the pain down by a process called ideation, i.e. the generation of ideas. The brain does not care what the ideas is, as long as it is an idea. It can be an idea about anything, such as “jesus loves me, the aliens will save us, whatever.
Broer Fanie, ek het al die formule gegee om te “bewys” dat God bestaan, maar dis nie ‘n “dooie” formule nie, en dit gaan nie jou vrye WIL dwing nie! Dis ‘n formule wat jy in betrokke moet wees teen alle redelike denke in, dis net hoe dit werk, as jy die “vryheid” het om dit te doen – hoekom nie, jy gaan mos nie uitgevang word dat jy ook “Swakhede” het nie! As jy eers aan die kant van die “rif” staan lyk die ouens aan die anderkant baie gestress en gebonde. . .
En as Freud nou vertel dat ‘n seun sy Pa wil doodmaak en sy ma bevrug (Oidupus?, kompleks) en dat die gedagte so skrikwekkend is dat die kind dit onderdruk en onderdruk hou sy hele lewe lank (Wat blykbaar energie vereis) – as dit dan nie in sy bewussyn inkom nie, waar is dit en waar word die gedagte gehou?
En die neo- korteks het ontwikkel omdat . . . . omdat . . . ( En daar is diere met “groter” kortekse as ander en Mallies se hond het al so ontwikkel dat die bewus is dat dit lewe!)
En dan nog net een ding as my liggaam uit dooie materie bestaan hoekom “lewe” ek dan of is ek bewus daarvan? Ek dink nie die mens kan gereduseer word na ‘n biologiese masjien nie. Ons is meer as dit!
Verifanie, jy mors jou tyd met hierdie cretin. Enige ou wat woorde uitkots soos “…..wat jy in betrokke moet wees teen alle redelike denke…”, kort behandeling. Johannie se “bewys” vir sy god vereis dat rasionele denke ge-elimineer moet word.
Sy denke som pragtig op hoekom gottediens so gevaarlik is. Maar hy sal dit nie insien nie, want rasionele denke maak nie deel uit van sy denkpatroon nie. Arme sot.
Fok weet Adriaan. My friendwho runs a Bed &Breakfast tells me she does not trust black guests to dish up for themselves at the dining room table. She has long distance travellers and tradesmen renting her rooms. If she puts eight lamb chops on a serving plate for four people on the understanding that each get two chops, the black guys will take all the meat if the Indian guys are even a minute late. The Indian understandably refuses to pay and the black guy pleads poverty. Simple meals like breakfast cereal have to be dished out in the kitchen and a single serving brought to the table for each customer. It is still advisable to separate blacks from other race groups at the dining room table in the same way that most blacks should be kept in maximum security prisons with their food shoved through a door hatch, much like a sliding hatch at the bottom of a coal bin, because black stuff always disintegrates with friction and sinks to the bottom and causes the most godawful bottlenecks that you need strong tongs to prise apart. Unfortunately one cannot do this kind of prising apart of our black brethren at public buffet parties which is why they are so very few of these functions these days.
Dankie vir die tip, Malherbe. ek het juis gewonder of ek die ou weer moet antwoord. Ek sou seker, as jy my nie gewaarsku dat ek my “perels voor die swyne gaan gooi nie” (Hoe’s daai vir ‘n lekker bybel versie?)
Hey guys, watch here how the sick get healed by prayer……….
Horrible screaming enough to burst any granny’s eardrums or maybe they are deaf from all this ghastly ranting already. Any organisation that generates an income from fraud should be closed down and the perps put into prison. That also goes for so-called churches that claim to perform exorcisms. I also take exception to church services where hymns are sung by any other than the vocally gifted within a radius of one kilometre of any neighbours.
Dit wys jou net, jy kan skatryk word van skelm wees. Dis gewoonlik die geval. ‘n Ou moet eintlik ‘n kursussie gaan doen in Pastorie. Dan kan jy vir mense vertel wat hulle wil hoor en goed geld maak. Nou en dan kan jy vir hulle vertel hoe om hulle huise skoon te kry van demone nl. Om alle heavymetal musiek te verban, alle new age ornamente uit die huis uit te smyt en olyf olie aan die mure te smeer em die huis te bevry van bose magte. Moet ook nie vergeet van enige Oosterse beeldtjies of wierook nie. O en dan is daar nog elwe,feetjies en tuinkabouters ook. Ouens ek weet nie hoe om videos hier te post nie maar kan een van julle vra om Dio se The man who would be king hier op te post. Dis nou nogal interresant. Dis op youtube. Gaan luister gerus! Long live heavy metal!
It is my contention that almost every human being in this world today, suffers to some extent, however small, from a neurosis that has become highly pervasive and universal. It ranges from those who are completely unaware that they are affected at all, to those who are seriously aware that they are afflicted, and who are desperately searching for a cure.
There are religious people who would actually like to free themselves of the burden they are carrying, being vaguely aware of feeling trapped by this yoke of religion that was fostered upon them since childhood, but the horrendous fear of a merciless, angry and revengeful god, paralyses them.
Although psychology, a la Arthur Janov, has long ago moved far away from useless Freudian nonsense, with its practice of creating hundreds of labels to try and describe every little nuance of our behaviours, I want to encourage those who want to know more about themselves to read up on some very obvious and neurotic behaviour syndromes such as narcissism, (especially mothers who display narcissistic tendencies).
Reading up on these matters will not cure you, but it will could make you aware of just how badly you were manipulated by either one or both of your parents. Many pastors, priests and evangelists, if truth ever be told, could now fit one or more of many different types of neuroses, with labels such as
being bi-polar (or manic-depressive), narcissistic, pre-psychotic, etc.
There is actually no need for labels. All neuroses, from mild to psychotic, is simply a manifestation of having suffered severe trauma that overloaded the defence systems of and individual. As I have mentioned before, (a la Janov,
and other researchers who are now realising this as well), this pain or trauma that I speak of, can happen in the womb, during birth, as a baby, a toddler, an onwards to adulthood.
Simply not having your needs met as a baby, or being left in a room to cry by yourself, or being smacked, shushed, shaken, or -prevented in any way from crying your pain out, is painful to our beings. This is what causes neuroses.
Neuroses is the defence mechanism, the act-out, the crutch, the coping mechanism, and it takes on almost any form such as smoking, drinking heavily, overeating, talking endlessly, doing crime, developing or clinging to a crazy idea such as a belief system, even physical maladies, also ADD, Alzheimers, and many more. The system is overloaded, under attack from the inside. We cope by acting out, ……….. and praying.
I couldn’t care less how fundies got that way, any more than I care why stupid people act stupidly, but I would tend to get out of the way of an out of control cement truck going downhill with the brakes off.
Broer Fanie, ek probeer uitvind wat dit is wat julle so seker van jul saak maak, ( ok ek lieg ek wil uitvind dat ons dieselfde dink en is ), en ek vertsaan die “ideation” ook soos jy (dink ek), – die korteks het ‘n filtreer sisteem wat gedagtes verhoed om in jou bewussyn in te kom en volgens jou is die metode wat gebruik word om ander verdoeselde gedagtes deur te laat sodat die die persoon nie bewus raak van die pyngedagtes nie.
Die verskil kan dalk wees oor die bewoording van wat die pyngedagtes is, ek lei af jy praat nie net van fisiese pyn nie, kan ek daarna verwys as die metafisiese sug (primal scream)? Is dit die enigste of eerste “sug” van die heelal en die mens en al die ander pyn net ‘n variassie op dit?
As dit so is hoe sou jy die metafiese sug bewoord of “wat is dit?”
Malherbe, ek gaan tog ‘n antwoord gee op Johann se skrywe, maar dit sal hopelik byval vind by almal. Daar is soveel om te verduidelik, indien ons mense wil help, anders word dit net ‘n kwessie van is…..issie…..is…..issie…..is
…..issie…..ens.
Die antwoord, deel 1
Johann, ek moet aanneem dat jy moontlik ‘n boek gelees het met die titel “The Primal Scream”. Die boek was geskryf in 1969 deur Dr. Arthur Janov, wie per toeval die ontdekking gemaak het dat baie van ons as lewende wesens, rondloop met soms ontsaglike pyn, beide emotioneel en fisies, maar dat hierdie pyn toegekelder word. Hy het met verdere navorsing bewys dat hierdie pyn vrygestel kan word, indien dit herleef word deur ‘n individu, en hetsy onder ideale omstandighede.
“Primal” beteken eerste, en het niks met metafisika uit te waai nie. Die “scream” verwys slegs na die heel eerste ding wat Janov waargeneem het by een van sy pasiente. Ons as mense, hetsy baba of volwassene, het ‘n reeks emosionele reaksies, vanaf diep ween of huil en treurigheid, tot by woedende uitbarsting en geskreeu van oordonderende woede.
Soos ek alreeds genoem het, ons eerste brein wat ontwikkel gedurende die eerste trimester, is die reptiel brein, of viscera. Kom ons noem dit die “first line”. Die tweede brein wat begin om te ontwikkel gedurende die tweede trimester, is die emotionele brein, of limbiese stelsel. Dit is dan “second line”. Dan volg die intellektuele brein, of neo-cortex, (new cortex), wat ons denkende brein is. Dit heet “third line”
***I am not going to cite research references. These can all be obtained
by simply reading either the blog, or any books of Dr. Arthur Janov. It is pure science, no less. (arthurjanov.com – click on “Janov’s reflections on the human condition”)
A pregnant women who either smokes, drinks, does drugs, gets beaten, is depressed, has no hope of financial help, lives alone, her husband/partner having left her, or any one of the above, will impart serious “first line” pain/trauma to the foetus inside her. The pain will register deeply within the foetus, where it will do most damage because of the foetus’ undeveloped defence system.
A horrible protracted birth will also impart horrendous pain to the baby, whose body, as per the evolutionary continuum, will immediately start screaming and wailing once it is breathing. If this crying/screaming is prevented, and if the baby/toddler/youngster was not allowed to cry and scream as she grew, the child of three or four years old, will “throw temper tantrums”.
How many of us have either been a victim or a witness, when a belt is taken
to a youngster that “throws a tantrum”? (Why do teenagers and adults commit suicide?)
Traumatic pain stays in the body, becoming a powerful force that wants out at all costs. It is an energy, albeit an unpleasant energy, always
pushing upwards, constantly knocking. Alas, parents, teachers and others do not allow us to use our built-in tool kit, i.e. our emotions and feelings.
Die antwoord deel 2…
Our built-in tool kit is actually “the expression of emotions and feelings”. Simple fact is, that it was always our feelings that were repressed. Btw, depression is not a feeling, it is a state of being. It means that all of one’s feelings/emotions have been repressed, leading to well…… depression.
If one is sad, one is still alive. One can cry, feel the sadness, If you’re not allowed to feel sad, you will become depressed. Same with anger, and other
feelings. A deep and extended cry, when one cries about the actual situation that caused the pain, is the most wonderful thing that can happen to any human. Note that the crying must be connected to the original trauma, otherwise it is not cathartic as it should be.
We can relive trauma from our past, connecting with the awful hurt, expel it through our emotions, and heal ourselves. Unfortunately, this has to be done with the help of a very experienced and highly trained therapist. This is a therapy that Dr. Arthur Janov has developed and honed to near perfection over a period of 47 years at the Primal Centre in Los Angeles.
Interestingly, patients who went there for therapy, who were actually religious, or had other ideations, lost all their ideas about religion/gods/angels/devils, and/or other crazy ideas, often without it having ever been discussed or one word even mentioned about it.
A fully feeling and connected human being, has no antisocial leanings, no inkling to “do unto others”, nor to control, exploit or abuse anyone. He/she feels no need to pray to or worship any gods or deities, and can allow their children to express all their feelings and emotions, and do so by true evolutionary instinct alone.
*****Dr. Arthur Janov has just been invited by the National Institute of Mental Health in the US to come and discuss and share his knowledge and research with them. This is a great breakthrough for humans at large, since mainstream psychology/psychiatry has failed us hopelessly. Alas, it will still take a thousand years to have any effect on a crazy planet. Too many crazy ideas, bibles, religions, churches, evangelists, cults, con-men, tricksters, drug dealers, drug addicts, greedy bastards, fucked up great grandparents, grandparents, parents, children, teachers…… also military institutions, sick governments, politicians …….and all the millions who are in total denial… !!
You know, all I can do is try, As the saying goes: “Perhaps there is still one light on upstairs”
At times I really feel very sorry for people who suffer so much, as you saw on those poor women’s faces in the video about that bastard Popoff. ( I wish he would pop off) He is back in the game of fucking lonely, lost people again. Can’t stop the devil now can you?
Yes, at times I get terribly pissed off at godiots, but they are really victims.
Victims of victims of victims, going back generations. Many or perhaps most of them had religion forced down their throats at such a young age – just as I had – and they feel totally trapped, helpless, hopeless, unless they keep focusing on jesus or the gotte.
Very true and unselfish comment Veri. You’re a better person than I. Suppose I should be greatful that by some miracle, I have discarded of the shackles of religion. Others are not that fortunate…
Lyk my Johann is ‘n fan van die psycho analytic school of thought. Ek weet nie hoeveel mens se onder bewussyn mens se gedrag kan beinvloed nie, maar ek dink nogsteeds dat wat Darwin gese het baie meer waar is as Freud se teorie. Die mens reageer defnitief nog baie op instink. Wat wel waar is dat as mens droom kom al jou onder bewustelikke gedagtes na vore. Jy heroep die wereld waarbinne jy leef in jou slaap. Ek vermoed dat as ‘n mens oor sekere dinge worry word dit ook deel van jou onderbewuste. Hoe meer van ‘n waarskynlikheid iets is, hoe groter is die vrees dat dit met jou sal gebeur. So jy droom daarvan, dan gebeur dit! Die rede dat dit baie keer gebeur is oordat dit hoogs waarskynlik is.So op ‘n mate word ‘n mens se drome waar. Veral jou nagmerries . As iemand jou bang maak met ‘n spinnekop as jy nog klein is, dan sal jy heelwaarskynlik ‘n vrees he vir spinnekoppe as jy groot is eendag. Daardie vrees is nie ‘n gedagte wat in jou kop woon nie maar dit is in gewire om jou te beskerm. ons breine beskerm ons teen die buite wereld deur verse. Ons oer voorouers wat in Afrika gebly het sou baat gevind het daarby om vrese vir sekere goed te he. As een van jou groep se mense deur ‘n mamba gepik word en doodgaan sou die ander defnitief ‘n vrees daarvoor gehad het. Die mens as ‘n spesie het ook hierdie ingewirede vrese. Spinnekoppe, slange, krokodille en groot roofdiere is defnitief baie vreesaanjaend vir die mens. Dit beskerm die spesie! So dit is nie regtig gedagtes wat onderbewustellik in ‘n mens se kop is nie maar dit meer ‘n ingewirede ding. Ek glo baie defnitief eerder Darwin se teorie as Freud sn.
In her US radio show, Dr. Ura Schlesinger said that, as an observant Orthodox Jew, homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned under any circumstance. Here is a response from a U.S citizen:
Dear Dr. Schlesinger,
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God’s Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination … I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God’s Laws and how to follow them.
Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can’t I own Canadians?
2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of Menstrual uncleanliness – Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord – Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should I ask the police to do it?
6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don’t agree. Can you settle this? Are there ‘degrees’ of abomination?
7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?
8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27. How should they die?
9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn’t we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
1I. I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I’m confident you can help.
Thank you again for reminding us that God’s word is eternal and unchanging.
Your adoring fan. James M. Kauffman, Ed.D. Professor Emeritus, Dept. Of Curriculum, Instruction, and Special Education, University of Virginia
P.S. It would be a damn shame if we couldn’t own a Canadian …..
Broer Fanie, dankie vir die stimuleerende geskrif, ek het my misgis met die afrikaans vir “primal scream”, soos jy dit verduidelik lyk dit nie na dieselfde konsep nie. Die metafisiese sug het vir my ‘n wyer betekenis. (Ek was nie bewus van Janov se teorie nie, en ek is seker dat hy baie mense al gehelp het en dat dit vir baie mense werk.)
Met die metafisiese sug gaan dit oor die mens se “sug” om te weet wat agter alles is wat is. Dit het nie net te doen met die mens en sy probleme, (eintlik probleempies – wat hy dink hy het nie) en oor sy ou lewe wat so belangrik is nie, dit gaan oor ‘n heel groter prentjie wat dit beteken en wat dit is om “mens” te wees. En my tyd is op ek het nog komentaar te lewer oor die “A fully feeling and connected human being, has no antisocial leanings”, dit is “iets” wat mens kan in belangstel en ook iets om na te streef, want ek weet nie wat dit beteken nie. . .
Adriaan, ek voel vir jou, sal dit nou lekker wees as jy jou persepssie kan “reset” en jou onbewuste kan uitvee (“Format”) en dan nuwe en skoon programme weer oplaai, van die wat JY wil hê. . ?
Vra die kundige op sielkunde of hy/sy jou kan help jy wil graag die geloofsprong maak en na wie kan jy gaan, sê net jy wil ook die ervaring hê wat jy nog nooit gehad het nie, sodat jy kan verstaan wat dit beteken. Dan kan jy terugstaan en tjill, want jy het nou alles gedoen wat jy hoef te doen.
Ek vra jou dit van die bodum van my hart af – doen dit jou tjiekensjt.
Broer Fanie, “A fully feeling and connected human being” Ek wil dit wees, ek raak gedurig anti sosiaal as ek bv. Mallies se ontlasting en braaksel lees, hoe kan ek myself genees? Jy het die teorie verduidelik, nou kan ek dit maar probeer.
As jy dalk onthou waarna die woord “dualisme” wys, dan behoort dit maklik te wees om te verstaan dat mense ‘n “konsep” God in daai neo-korteks “skep”.
Dis dan dat daar verwys word na die mens is die skepper van sy eie God. Ek kan dit verstaan, maar hoekom stop mens daar, wat as “non-duality” ook bekyk word, hoe sou dinge dan gelyk het, ek verstaan dat kwantum fisisie tot gevolgtrekking gekom het dat “duality” is ‘n “myth”, wat dit ook al vir hulle beteken, maar as mens met non-duality “houding” jou persepsie verander, hoe sou dit gelyk het. . .?
Baie mense en Mallies getuig daaroor, het die konsep god probeer “worship” (eendag, wens ek, sal ons met daai woord by dieselfde plek uitkom – “worship”) en natuurlik het nugtere verstand ons almal seker daarvan laat weg draai. Ek kan dit ook verstaan, maar hoekom weer ‘n keer stop, hoekom gaan soek mens dan nie verder nie, want om te “glo” is bokant “rede”.
Ek weet ek kan dit vir jou so stel, want jy het al ‘n paadjie geloop.
I might want to believe the moon is made of cheese and has a will of its own, and part of that will is going to send a multi flavoured cheese meteorite into my back garden so I needn’t bother to stock up on gouda, edam, cheddar or brie at PnP, but reason tells me that’s not likely to happen anytime soon. You might think that is an absurd example, but I have seen too many people’s lives messed up by the kind of religion that says, “God will provide” and “Thanks to God for helping me make it through another year”. These are examples of not just magical but short term thinking. It’s a denial of responsibility. If God is not providing, or if they’re going through a rough patch with even poorer prospects, they will look for scapegoats because this is part of their magical thinking. God’s plan is not working for some reason, they reason. It can’t be God’s fault, so it must be someone else’s.
“ .. ek verstaan dat kwantum fisisie (sic) tot gevolgtrekking gekom het dat “duality” is ‘n “myth”, ..”
Johann, los liewer enige skrywe oor die wetenskap uit, want jy is ‘n aap op diè gebied. Gaan lees bietjie oor Thomas Young se interferensie eksperiment om jou kennis oor die kwantum teorie te verbreed. Jy het per ongeluk raakgeskiet deurdat daar wel fisici was (en is) (Einstein was die eerste een) wat sê dualiteit te wyte is aan die feit dat ons nie op die kwantumvlak kan “sien” wat aangaan nie. D.w.s die kwantum teorie is nog nie volledig beskryf nie. Louis de Brogli het gepostuleer, en dit is later eksperimenteel bewys, dat nie net elektromagnetiese golwe partikel èn golf-eienskappe openbaar nie, maar enige partikel ook golf-eienskappe het. Die huidige gevoel onder die meerderheid fisici is dat die kwantum teorie onvolledig is, maar dat dualisme ‘n mite is, is nonsens.
Who is this woman? She mentions she is a previous Miss SA? Quite strange that she has to repeat everything in Arabic during her conversion. One would think that Allah would understand English.
Just goes to show that all religions have irrationality in common.
Silly you, God’s been an Arab all along. I wonder what she thinks she will get in the afterlife, does she believe seven gorgeous young Arabs will come thundering along on horseback to relieve her of her recycled virginity when she finally gets to Allah’s paradise? Why wait that long when you can get gangraped and thrown in jail in this lifetime, right next to a mosque in Gaza. Typical old narcissist who’s been dumped by too many white guys who see through her delusional, egocentred bullshit, now she thinks she will hit it off with the Arabs.
Batshit crazy! She strikes me as the hippie type. The way she sits, talks, gestures etc. From the arms of one god to the arms of the next. I bet you if she hasn’t tried it yet, she will be a Buddhist soon enough.
Koel Diek vir ‘n oomblik het ek die gevoelgekry jy praat “af” na my toe en toe vertel jy my weereens dat die arme wetenskaplikes kan nie agter kom wat gaan aan nie. . . . (Teoriee kom en teoriee gaan♪ ♪)
Wat betekenisvol is is wat beteken dit…? Wat maak dit saak inelkgeval – soos julle atties wat “glo” (sonder bewyse) dat as jy sterf dan is dit dieselfde soos dit was voor jy gebore is – jy weet niks . . .?
Wat beteken ‘dualisme” en “non-dualisme” vir die mens ? En nie vir die biologiese masjien nie?
Is so Adriaan, maar nie in die koppe van die godbots en onse paaivreter nie. “Niemand weet wat gravitasie is nie”, en “dualisme bestaan nie in die kwantum nie”, om net twee voorbeelde van laasgenoemde se begrip van die wetenskap te noem. Die wetenskap berus op bewyse d.m.v. eksperimente. Paaivreter het nou nog nie enige bewys van sy gode se bestaan gebring nie. En dan verwag hy ons moet so delusional soos hy word deur ‘n “geloofsprong” te maak. Nie maklik nie.
Religion is a dangerous drug and every place of worship and every religious icon should carry a warning: “Religion can make you even more delusional than you already are and can totally destroy your life.” You get people who are moderately religious to start off with, but when the promises fail to materialise the same way the ANC’s promises don’t – not for nothing did Jacob Zuma say the ANC will rule till Jesus comes – the godbots go into obsessive mode, seeking out esoteric shops to damn them for their false idols and their blasphemy, going into peoples homes and telling them they will go to hell if they have vases with dragons on them, get rid of that little buddha in the flower tub, you need a crucifix in every room, then you realise that you are dealing with someone who has to hit rock bottom before they come to their senses, and they are going to take you with them on their crazy crusade. It’s sad when it happens to a friend but you get to the point where you have to cut your losses and walk away.
Mallies – “onbegrip kan nie dien as bewys van die bonatuurlike ” Eerstens weet jy nie wat die woord bonatuurlike na toe wys nie, tweedens as “bewussyn” nie bewys kan word deur Koel Diek se wetenskap nie, beteken dit dan dat dié nie bestaan nie, ek dog ons was al hier oor en daar het geen verandering in jou “neo-korteks” plaas gevind nie. . . .?
“verwag hy ons moet so delusional soos hy word deur ‘n “geloofsprong” te maak. Nie maklik nie” . . . .Kan julle dit nie eens doen vir een misrabele dag in jul lewens nie, dit wat julle aan glo het so ‘n sterk houvas op julle , verbind en verblind, en natuurlik is die afgode wat julle “worswhip” verskrik dat as julle die geloofsprong maak gaan julle oë oopgaan en die afgode se delusionaliteit aan julle bekend gemaak word, waarom waarom kan julle nie hoor nie, ek was waar julle nou is, ek het my eie konsep god probeer “worship” en dit het nie gewerk nie want dit is vals, maar ek het nie daar opgehou nie, ek het verder gaan soek. Moenie nou die heeltyd terug gaan na jul eie braaksel en dan nog verder daarop braak nie.
En Broer Fanie het nou verander in vinnige Fanie (terug grot toe), het julle niks verstaan wat hy geskryf het nie? En wie kan sê dat gravitase nie delusional is nie, miskien is die plekke waar ruimte tyd gebuig is ‘n vergaderplek van energie wat ons na verwys as planete, en behalwe Koel Diek weet niemand nie.
Drinking too much is often a sign of depression. There are meds that control the physical craving for alcohol. Once the physical addiction is under control the psychological issues can be addressed – in fact, once the addiction is controlled, the depression can disappear by itself because alcohol is a central nervous depressant.
Johann, jy het al hierdie fantastiese feite voor jou. Hoekom strewe jy so na die bonatuurlikke? Jy wil gefassineerd wees met goed waarvan jy nie veel weet nie nl. Die bonatuurlikke. Daar is ‘n seding wat se dat die metafisiese van vandag die wetenskap van more is.
Adriaan so af en toe kom daar iets van jou af wat my weer hoop gee, die feite waarvan jy praat is die mense wat ‘n “lyk” ondersoek, m.a.w. dis ‘n dooie ding en dit hou hulle net aan die raai en al klink dit nou baie slim, gaan daar nie veel van kom nie, hoe vêrder die wetenskaplikes krap hoe meer vrae ontstaan daar – ek verkies eerder om aan die kant van die lewendiges te bly, en ek weet wat ons doen is om te “lewe”, maar wat dit beteken is meer belangrik as om te probeer “bewys” dan ander mense verkeerd is, – ek sou eerder “aan” wou beweeg asom heeltyd andermense te blameer vir wat ek self aan skuldig is. (M. a.w. dat ek die doel van my lewe mis omdat ek glo dat ek verwyder is van God, mense verwys daarna as sonde – mis jou doel).
En wat ek lees van jou en die ander daar op die grondboontjie gallery is “hulp krete”. Wat in jul onderbewussyn onderdruk word.
McBrolloks 
I think many Jews lost their faith during WW2. Suppose Johannie would expect of them to do the “geloofsprong” again.
What I find interesting about some of my Jewish friends, is that many of them are technically atheists. However, they still adhere to the habits and culture of Judaism. Almost like belonging to an exclusive club.
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How Johann sees himself:
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Ek het net so `n idee dat Johann nie naastenbaai so cool is nie. (En daadrie ouens lyk almal soos ‘n klomp paaivreters)
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Ek het ‘n geloofsprong gemaak dat Johann ‘n snor het.
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Met so ‘n bokbaardjie daarby.
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Unfortunately I live right next door to a fundie arsehole. He has a big white handlebar moustache. This old toppie sticks his nose wherever it isn’t wanted, which is – everywhere. His wife is a full time Jesus worshipping “housewife” and specialises in vicious gossip. They carry on like they are street police, monitoring everyone elses doings and screwings. The wife likes to stand at the neighbour’s fence across the road gossiping with that neighbour’s wife, so they can have a good view of what everyone else is doing, and glare at people when they enter their driveways as if they have something on them. She pretends she goes on walks and only bumps into the neighbours when they just happen to be in their front gardens. Whenever she sees me turn into my driveway she scuttles away from the neighbour’s fence, bolts down the road, crosses it, and pretends to be on a walk back towards her own house as I take my groceries out of the boot.
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Oh and she doesn’t have a car of course. Her husband has a car and a motorfiets as befits an Angus Buchan groupie.
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Jo! Jo! Daai video, hy’s baie kak! Deel ons regtig die planet met sulke goed. Dit was verskriklik, terrible, horrible, nasty, kak, stront, fucked up, aaklig, stupid, ontalentvol! John Lennon draai in sy graf om!
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Ja nee!!!!! Maar as jy mos in spoke glo is kak smaak mos deel van die hele package.
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Ja hulle het gewoonlik swak smaak ( Hierdie klomp happy clappys ). Ek onthou toe Poena is koning uitgekom het, het ds. Jannie Pelser dit gaan kyk. Hy was blykbaar baie erg geskok gewees! Nou vra ek myself af, was hy so uiters naief om te dink hy gaan nou na ‘n lekker familie film kyk? Meeste Afrikaanse films is ‘n klomp commin gemors! Is Jannie bitter naief, is hy commin of het hy doelbewus vir kak gaan soek?
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I made the mistake of buying a copy of Poena is ‘n Poes and vomited all over the sofa.
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What else these Hans Drol wankers get up to. If I were an Afrikaner I would moer these paaivreter konte for making Afrikaners look kak. Break his fingers and shove the drumsticks up his arse.
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Ja fok, “paaivreter konte” sums them up pretty well!
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Sorrie same vid twice. Here’s the other one.
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Not too bad. As long as this Bono poepol paaivreter keeps his mouth shut!
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What actually is the definition of a “Paaivreter”? Ek weet Johann is ‘n imbesiel maar is alle imbesiele “paaivreters” of is alle “paaivreters” imbesiele? (Nou het ek myself in ‘n knoop.)
Johann-Paaivreter, help asseblief en vertel my wat jy is.
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Ja Savage,
Toe ek op laerskool was het my een vriend se pa die woord paaivreter gebruik vir mense wat hy nie van gehou het nie. Ons het nooit geweet wat presies dit beteken het nie. Maar ons het beslis geweet dit is in lyn met poepol en drol. Johann is beslis ‘n paaivreter.
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Waar is DJ paaivreter? Why isn’t he in the house? Het ons dalk sy gees uiteindelik gebreek? Het ons actually die laaste se gese? Ek het nooit gedog die dag sal kom dat Johann nie meer met ons is nie.
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Ek het nou uiteindelik die video’s gesien en ja ek stem sam dat hulle eerder moet acid en zoll rook dat hulle ook soos julle “verlig” kan word. Kyk nou net hoe goeie voorbeeld stel die Antwoord vir die kinders, baie beter as Sondag skool!
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Inane chewing of gum plus premature beerbelly makes the lead “dancer” look like a pregnant goat. Silly little girls chewing wads of gum look like geitlammetjies. Too much beer, fatty meat and koeksisters makes the boerewors belt 20kg overweight by the age of 35, at latest.They have meetings for the ladies on “innerlike skoonheid” as well as “uiterlike skoonheid” but this does not seem to apply to the menfolk.
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And don’t forget about the Brandy and Coke!
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Ek het die Ateis sprong gemaak! Ek wonder hoeveel van vandag se sogenaamde ” Jesus freaks ” se tipe sou actually 2000 jaar terug geskree het ” Kruisig hom! ” Mcbrolloks ek like jou site moerse! Maar ek is bevrees dat die folklore van geslag tot geslag oorgedra word. Minipulation of young minds! Ek onthou toe ek klein was het my ouers my maak my kerk klere aantrek en ‘n foto van my geneem voor kerk. My pa het gedreig dat hy my sal klap as ek nie ophou huil nie. Vandag is ek ‘n grootmens met depressie en ek is ‘n totale right off. Die monstrosity van religion leef voort. Ek haat my fokken pa! Hy het alhoewel ook volwasse geword met die tyd heen en ek wonder of hy self nog glo aan daai fokken bullshit. Fuck all religious people, long live atheists!!!! O gaan kyk ‘n bietjie na Pat Condell op youtube. Malherbe vir jou wil ek se, aangesien jy nog klein kindertjies het, luister na jou kinders! As iets hulle pla praat met hulle daaroor. Moenie dink – Dit is nou maar net ‘n kind, hy moet met sy karretjies daar buite gaan speel en sy bek hou. Dis wat my ouers gedoen het en kyk watter fokop is ek vandag. Kinders het ook gevoelens! Alhoewel dit vir sekere mense bitter moeilik is om te verstaan.
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Adriaan I suspect you have an IQ in the upper stratosphere which makes you impermeable to bullshit. People with built in integrity get depressed because they don’t understand that not everybody else is on their level. Try to associate with people who are at least as bright as you, because the other direction doesn’t work for you.
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Adriaan ek het voorheen vir jou vertel dat die stressor in jou lewe is jou Pa en dis nie die fisiese pa daar buite nie, dis die psigise “pa” in jou kop, kyk daarna en kyk waar kom jou gedagtes vandaan, en dan “herskep” jy jou wêreld sonder al die sjt wat jy daarin gesit het.
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En vir al julle musiek kritici, kan ons ander dalk julle “video’s” sien asb. Of wat van julle lirieke, wys tog net dat julle nie net op die kantlyn staan en kritiseer nie, maar dat julle “weet’ waarvan julle praat!
En ek dog paai is 3.142. . . . .∞ en dat julle eerder paai vreters is. . .maar dit wys my ook dat daar dinge in jou jeug gebeur wat jy saamdra na jou volwasse lewe, daars is ‘n woord daarvoor. .iets soos “tranference” (Eric Berne dink ek – road less traveled)
Dit wat gewerk het toe jy ‘n kind was sal nie noodwendig werk as jy volwasse is nie. En dis duidelik dat Mad Mac en Adriaan hul “jeug” nog saam met hulle dra.
Maar Molly laat ons jou musiek hoor, en as jy nog daai “rokspaaider” en rooinek stryd in jou dra kan ons daaroor praat, ek weet die kween (fossiel) aanhangers het ‘n probleem met hul eie waardigheid, veral as hulle met die europeen in kontak kom.
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En die paai in paaivreter tref my nou eers, dit verwys natuurlik na vroulike anatomie, en vandag ken ons dit sommer net as BJ. So die “vriend se pa” wou graag heimlik daai paai gevreet het, maar hy kon nie die moed bymekaar skraap om dit te doen nie, toe reageer hy teenoor sy begeerte net soos julle teenoor die geloofspring doen!
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Johann, ek het my pel self gevra wat die woord beteken. Dit was sy pa wat dit baie gebruik het. Hier is sy verduideliking:
“Hey Mack, ‘n “paaivreter” is die naam wat die manne op die myne in Rustenburg gebruik het vir iemand wat “kak sleg” of “useless” was. En as jy in RSA gebly in die ’80 sal jy ook presies verstaan as ek jou verduidelik waar dit vandaan kom. In die tyd was daar in elke woonwyk ‘n “café” (Die kaffee op die hoek) en elke “café” het ‘n verwarmde rak met glas deure gehad wat altyd vol met Pie’s was (Meestal was dit ‘n Griek se kaffee en die het altyd pie’s verkoop) Nou die “paaivreters” was die mense wat te kak sleg was om te kook en te useless om te spaar vir ‘n keer na ‘n egte restaurant te gaan, dus dan gaan koop hulle pie’s by die Griek!”
So jy is alweer verkeerd Johann. Jou paaivreter!
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Ja Mac, en dan het hy boonop ‘n “dirty mind”. Hy maak onmiddelik ‘n seksuele konneksie. Wonder of sy liewe jessussie hiervan sal hou. Ek meen, seks is so taboe onder die godiote dat hulle nie kan glo jesussie is die resultaat van ‘n doodnormale seksdaad nie. Siek spulletjie, die paaivreters.
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Ha ha, remmeber that old crack about the difference between a King Pie and a condom? Condom has more meat in it. You get better pies and microwave meals at PnP these days. Single guys buy that stuff. What hasn’t changed since the eighties is that South African men refuse to cook dinner. Eating alone in a restaurant reeks of desperation. Saffer guys only eat in restaurants if they can organise a date who is expected to pay in kind.
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Johann doesn’t know the difference between cunnilingus and a blowjob. Sex should only happen to make babies, fully clothed via a hole in the sheet.
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Verifanie
Hi McBrollocks and all the other folks,
I can’t remember if I ever posted any comments on this blog. I did partake in the debates on Nathan Bond’s Tart remarks for a number of years. (McBrollocks and Savage you will probably remember)
I am a fully blown proud and happy atheist. Been so since the age of 18.
I also had a horrid childhood as a result of being the youngest in a sick, god-struck family of eight children. Poverty, almost daily beatings, non-stop preaching and bible-down-your-throat shit. I am happy to say that I worked through most of the craziness, with help, by getting in touch with severely suppressed feelings and emotions, and being able to express them fully, through deep crying, massive anger and other emotions.
It’s been over thirty years of continuous growing. I would like to post on this blog from time to time. I have gained deep insights into the human condition.
I know today that, as Malherbe hinted, that people grab onto a belief system because they had suffered as babies, toddlers, teenagers, even whilst in the womb……… and many still do, as fully grown adults.
Belief in a god, a deity or any unearthly or supernatural being, is a coping mechanism, a crutch, a defence mechanism, just as any other act-out like alcohol, smoking, drugs, crime or whatever, that prevents one from becoming aware of the real trauma and suffering that took place. Denial becomes the
sine qua non: “I am so happy in jesus…..” etc.
Because the coping mechanism or act-out is working, many believers/alcoholics/smokers/workaholics/talk-aholics/overeaters/criminals/sex addicts/all other addicts…. will be unaware of their traumatic childhood. After all, can anyone be expected to remember what had happened to them during gestation, or as a tiny baby, without being in a program that has been developed to do just that?
The body remembers all… and every painful traumatic experience such as not having had one’s needs met, i.e. not being held, loved, caressed, fed when hungry, not being allowed to cry, scream, get angry, to sass, to play, to run, to express ideas or opinions…. remains in our being for life, unless we have the opportunity as adults to go back to those painful moments, and expel the pain once again through the emotions.
Many, from infancy to teenage years, still get physically slapped or beaten, suppressed, told to stop crying, etc.
Dis nou genoeg vir eers..
P.S. ….. If abortion is murder, then a blowjob must be cannibalism…?
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Hi Verifanie!!!!
Long time brother!!!! Welcome! You are a fresh new voice here. You can probably smell the tang of shit the fundies always leave where ever they go. We have some peaches here all right. Or to be more precise, bloody trolls!
Looking forward to your postings here. Enjoy!
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I do have a question about cannibalism. If a chef makes a salad, and rasps carrots into the salad, and accidentally slices some of his skin and flesh off and that ends up in the salad, can one consider it cannibalism if someone eats that salad?
When dining with cannibals, never eat the onion rings!
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Hi Verifanie. Yes, remember you from Nathan’s blog. Really enjou ConTester’s sharp wit and incredible knowledge and insight. Theck out the godiots on this blog. Everywhere equally braindead.
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Thanks for the welcome folks,
My contention is that it is not only a belief in a god or gods or deities that can be considered crazy or in fact insane. It is, in my opinion, any and all beliefs and ideas i.e. aliens, astrology, tarot cards, supernatural powers, scientology,
magic, voodoo, fortune telling, and the list goes on forever. McBrollocks, this blog could actually be expanded to discuss all ideations and craziness. There is little difference between one who is an alcoholic and one who is obhsessed with his or her gods…..
All of this is a clear sign that humans are ill. Suffering from childhoods that allowed no freedom of expression of fears, tears, pain, thought and opinions,
not having been allowed to cry their little hearts out, which is a feature that evolution endowed us with, to heal us and remove the pain, and that has been sadly suppressed for perhaps thousands of years.
We, most of us today,did not grow up free. When we cried, we were shushed and shaken, talked to, (“ooh, look at the moon”) etc., or were simply told that
we will be “given something to cry about”. We were sent to schools where the teachers, most of them also suffering from this universal neurosis, screamed at us, insulted us, beat us, while we were forced to sit for hours on end listening to headshit that was forced down our throats. No fucking wonder that
“jesus is so sweet and kind and will never hurt us” etc.
If only everyone could start by reading let’s say, a book titled Summerhill, by A.S. Neill. , or Problem Parents, not Problem Children. , or Freedom, not Licence. Also any one of Arthur Janov’s works, numbering 16 books by now, the first one being The Primal Scream, from 1969.
McBrollocks.. er..yes, the tang of shit hangs widely over most of this fucked up planet. I do admit that religious shit smells deeper, darker, and worse than most others’
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Malherbe yes, ole Con-tester is the smart one. High intelligence and sharp wit. He never seems to tire from posting on Nathan’s blog. I wonder why Nathan hasn’t posted anything new in a very long time. Perhaps too busy, now that he seems to be leaning in the direction of politics?
Now and then I google “Atheist comedians” for a good laugh. It is surprising how many there are. I think most comedians are atheists. Here’s a real beauty:
“You know, everyone wears these crosses around their necks, waiting for jesus to come back to earth. Does anyone think that when he arrives here, that he will want to see a cross again?”
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Should read: ……does anyone think that he will be glad to see a cross again?
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Ha ha. Good point. A really excellent atheist comedian is Aussie Tim Minchen. The guy is super talented: excellent pianist, comedian, songwriter and on top of it a BsC graduate. Really hilarious. Google the piece “Storm” on youtube – my favourite.
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Quick joke – Kent Hovind.
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You guys, please go and sighn the petition to keep Kent Hovind in jail. I did so.
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Malherbe, I checked out Tim Minchen, thanks. Another guy whose understated with I find very funny is Dave Allen. Check this one out:
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This guy is good!
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Haai ouens en meisies,
Hier is vir julle almal ‘n artikel om aan te peusel, wat vir ons almal duidelik bewys hoe sg. “heilige, gotsvresende, gristene” ‘n arme jong dogtertjie se lewe kan opfok vir altyd. Die kerk, haar ouers, pastore en almal om haar is/was
ernstig skuldig aan die gruweldade wat aan haar gepleeg is.
http://www.rapport.co.za/Suid-Afrika/Nuus/Grysaard-tronk-toe-oor-dade-in-1986-20130518
Fokken poes “heilige” gristene. ek wens julle almal vrek!!!
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Ja dis ‘n tipiese Afrikaner opvoedingspraktyk. Kinders mag nie teepraat nie, hulle moet maar net alles verdra! Grootmense is mos altyd reg. Ek kan nie glo watter klomp lafhaarts die Afrikaner is nie. Tipiese ” Oom by die kerk”. Hierdie klomp christene is ‘n klomp vieslikke goed! Hulle irriteer my verskriklik! Die ergste van die ergste is nie dominees nie maar pastore. Dat daai ouens so baie geld maak uit bullshit praat uit kan ek nie glo nie. Leuens wat mense ryk maak. Miskien moet ek self so ‘n ou praktytjie oopmaak. Daai ouens is in anyway net so min heilig as ek.
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Adriaan, toe ek ‘n jong laaitie was, hier in die vyftigs en vroee sestigs, was daar ouens in die AGS kerk wie later, d.m.v. die destydse AGS kollege pastore geword het. Jy kon die kollege bywoon met net ‘n standerd agt geleerdheid. Daar was gerugte dat van hulle slegs std. ses gehad het, maar dit kan ek nie bevestig nie.
My suster se swaer, wie ook een van hierdie simpele pastore was, het haar eendag in haar eie huis verkrag. As gevolg van die vrees wat in ons ingebliksem was as kinders, het sy dit nooit aan iemand genoem nie, tot so vier jaar gelede. Hy het intussen gevrek. Ons was agt kinders. Ek is die enigste een wie my geheel en al onttrek het van al die kranksinnigheid, die leuens, die onderdrukking van idees en gevoelens, ens. Die res, die oorledenes en die wie nog leef, is en was “happy-clappy” opgefoktes, tot hul dood, en tot vandag toe nog.
Ek onthou die AGS kerk as ‘n plek waar daar histeriese dienste gehou was. Mense het begin om so ‘n klomp kak te skree (tale praat), neergedonder,
(heilige gees gevang) ens. Dit was skrikwekkend vir ‘n jong kind om te aanskou.
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More stupid religious hysteria.
—————————————-
‘Stampede in Ghana capital kills 4’
A nurse bandages a victim’s left leg in a hospital in Accra on May 19, others injured in a stampede at a church in the Ghanaian capital, police say.
On Sunday, the incident took place at famous church in Accra, where thousands of worshippers had gathered for an offer of anointing water they believe can cure illnesses.
“In trying to get it, a stampede happened,” police spokesman Freeman Tetty said, adding, “Four are confirmed dead, and 30 are injured, some in critical condition.”
Tetty also said an investigation was underway to determine the cause of the accident.
One of those injured in the stampede said, “People from the back, they pushed… and they fell on us. So we were battered by a lot of forces.”
Reverend Sam McCaanan said later on a local radio station that the plan to offer the water had been canceled.
“We are devastated, it is very unfortunate, and we are very sorry,” McCaanan said.
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2013/05/20/304387/stampede-in-ghana-capital-kills-4/
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Oh, the irony.
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. . .”My contention is that it is not only a belief in a god or gods or deities that can be considered crazy or in fact insane. It is, in my opinion, any and all beliefs and ideas” Dis nou Broer Fanie se skrywe laank terug, nou het ek net gewonder Broer fanie glo jy “dit”?
Is dit nou ‘n “idee” of is dit ‘n stelling wat jy “glo”. . .? “all beliefs and ideas” y skiet ‘n bietjie wyd ou.
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Johann,
Nouja, waar begin ek….. Eerstens, is dit nie net myns insiens nie , maar ook die van vele ander ernstige denkers, navorsers, wetenskaplikes en dies meer. Jy moet net ‘n bietjie wyer lees, soos bv. van James Randi daar in Amerika.
Hy het al vir jarre lank ‘n prys van een miljoen dollar aan enigiemand wie kan bewys dat enige van die esoteriese kak waaraan mense glo, waar is,
Numerlogie, astrologie, christendom, tarot kaarte, fortuinvertellery, genees-deur-gebed, psigiese kommunikasie, ens.
Tot vandag toe, het niemand nog ooit die prys gewen nie. Het jy dalk enige wetenskaplike bewyse dat enige van hierdie wensdenkery waar is?
Ons as menslike diere, is die enigste weses op aarde wie verbeeldingskragte het. Dit is a.g.v. die feit dat ons ‘n neo-cortex ontwikkel het. Dit is ons derde brein, en die heel jongste in terme van die tydperk van evolusionele vooruitgang. Ons oudste brein is die viscera, die oer-brein, of reptiel-brein, soos jy sal vind in visse, krokodille, ens. Daarna het die limbiese stelsel gekom. Dit is die emosionele brein, die kern van ons gevoelens en emosies.
Hierdie twee breine is honderde miljoene jare ouer as die neo-cortex. Aldrie die breine is tot vandag nog in ons skedels.
Ons as menslike wesens, het begin dink a.g.v. ons neo-cortex. Ons het begin wonder oor dinge. Ons het idees ontwikkel, soos bv. dat daar gode is, en dat hulle ons seen en straf, soos dinge beter en slegter gaan met ons. Idees.
Diere het nie idees nie, net ons as mense. Hulle glo nie in gode of enige ander van die kak wat ons tot dusver uitgedroom het oor die sowat honderd duisend jaar wat ons die neo-cortex het nie.
What we know today is that our intellect, or neo-cortex, has what is called a “gating” mechanism. It puts out a blocking system or “gates” that prevent extraordinary pain or trauma from reaching our consciousness, that has the power to kill us. Once the pain is blocked, the neo-cortex keeps the pain down by a process called ideation, i.e. the generation of ideas. The brain does not care what the ideas is, as long as it is an idea. It can be an idea about anything, such as “jesus loves me, the aliens will save us, whatever.
To read more about this, here is a link:
http://www.activitas.org/index.php/nervosa/article/view/146/183
P.S. ek sien iemand het my video van Dave Allen vervang met ‘n video van Hans Drommedaris poepol……..
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Daai video van Dave Allen is nog steeds daar.
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Should read: …..does not care what the idea is or ideas are……
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Broer Fanie, ek het al die formule gegee om te “bewys” dat God bestaan, maar dis nie ‘n “dooie” formule nie, en dit gaan nie jou vrye WIL dwing nie! Dis ‘n formule wat jy in betrokke moet wees teen alle redelike denke in, dis net hoe dit werk, as jy die “vryheid” het om dit te doen – hoekom nie, jy gaan mos nie uitgevang word dat jy ook “Swakhede” het nie! As jy eers aan die kant van die “rif” staan lyk die ouens aan die anderkant baie gestress en gebonde. . .
En as Freud nou vertel dat ‘n seun sy Pa wil doodmaak en sy ma bevrug (Oidupus?, kompleks) en dat die gedagte so skrikwekkend is dat die kind dit onderdruk en onderdruk hou sy hele lewe lank (Wat blykbaar energie vereis) – as dit dan nie in sy bewussyn inkom nie, waar is dit en waar word die gedagte gehou?
En die neo- korteks het ontwikkel omdat . . . . omdat . . . ( En daar is diere met “groter” kortekse as ander en Mallies se hond het al so ontwikkel dat die bewus is dat dit lewe!)
En dan nog net een ding as my liggaam uit dooie materie bestaan hoekom “lewe” ek dan of is ek bewus daarvan? Ek dink nie die mens kan gereduseer word na ‘n biologiese masjien nie. Ons is meer as dit!
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Verifanie, jy mors jou tyd met hierdie cretin. Enige ou wat woorde uitkots soos “…..wat jy in betrokke moet wees teen alle redelike denke…”, kort behandeling. Johannie se “bewys” vir sy god vereis dat rasionele denke ge-elimineer moet word.
Sy denke som pragtig op hoekom gottediens so gevaarlik is. Maar hy sal dit nie insien nie, want rasionele denke maak nie deel uit van sy denkpatroon nie. Arme sot.
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Ja ouens, miskien kan Johann vir ons verduidelik wat is God se plan met donker Afrika.
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Fok weet Adriaan. My friendwho runs a Bed &Breakfast tells me she does not trust black guests to dish up for themselves at the dining room table. She has long distance travellers and tradesmen renting her rooms. If she puts eight lamb chops on a serving plate for four people on the understanding that each get two chops, the black guys will take all the meat if the Indian guys are even a minute late. The Indian understandably refuses to pay and the black guy pleads poverty. Simple meals like breakfast cereal have to be dished out in the kitchen and a single serving brought to the table for each customer. It is still advisable to separate blacks from other race groups at the dining room table in the same way that most blacks should be kept in maximum security prisons with their food shoved through a door hatch, much like a sliding hatch at the bottom of a coal bin, because black stuff always disintegrates with friction and sinks to the bottom and causes the most godawful bottlenecks that you need strong tongs to prise apart. Unfortunately one cannot do this kind of prising apart of our black brethren at public buffet parties which is why they are so very few of these functions these days.
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Dankie vir die tip, Malherbe. ek het juis gewonder of ek die ou weer moet antwoord. Ek sou seker, as jy my nie gewaarsku dat ek my “perels voor die swyne gaan gooi nie” (Hoe’s daai vir ‘n lekker bybel versie?)
Hey guys, watch here how the sick get healed by prayer……….
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Horrible screaming enough to burst any granny’s eardrums or maybe they are deaf from all this ghastly ranting already. Any organisation that generates an income from fraud should be closed down and the perps put into prison. That also goes for so-called churches that claim to perform exorcisms. I also take exception to church services where hymns are sung by any other than the vocally gifted within a radius of one kilometre of any neighbours.
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That sys it all! The only miracle happening on a daily basis are people believing this shit.
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Should read “That says it all…
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Any more typos and I’m volunteering your services for The New Age, Malherbe.
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Am I that bad? Please warn me when I get as bad as the average godbot (if that is possible).
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Nah, nobody sucks sour lemons as much as a godbot.
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Dit wys jou net, jy kan skatryk word van skelm wees. Dis gewoonlik die geval. ‘n Ou moet eintlik ‘n kursussie gaan doen in Pastorie. Dan kan jy vir mense vertel wat hulle wil hoor en goed geld maak. Nou en dan kan jy vir hulle vertel hoe om hulle huise skoon te kry van demone nl. Om alle heavymetal musiek te verban, alle new age ornamente uit die huis uit te smyt en olyf olie aan die mure te smeer em die huis te bevry van bose magte. Moet ook nie vergeet van enige Oosterse beeldtjies of wierook nie. O en dan is daar nog elwe,feetjies en tuinkabouters ook. Ouens ek weet nie hoe om videos hier te post nie maar kan een van julle vra om Dio se The man who would be king hier op te post. Dis nou nogal interresant. Dis op youtube. Gaan luister gerus! Long live heavy metal!
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Adriaan, select share and a code appears. Copy and paste. That’s all there is to it.
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Well spotted, by the way. Lyrics are brilliant. Find us some more of that good stuff.
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It is my contention that almost every human being in this world today, suffers to some extent, however small, from a neurosis that has become highly pervasive and universal. It ranges from those who are completely unaware that they are affected at all, to those who are seriously aware that they are afflicted, and who are desperately searching for a cure.
There are religious people who would actually like to free themselves of the burden they are carrying, being vaguely aware of feeling trapped by this yoke of religion that was fostered upon them since childhood, but the horrendous fear of a merciless, angry and revengeful god, paralyses them.
Although psychology, a la Arthur Janov, has long ago moved far away from useless Freudian nonsense, with its practice of creating hundreds of labels to try and describe every little nuance of our behaviours, I want to encourage those who want to know more about themselves to read up on some very obvious and neurotic behaviour syndromes such as narcissism, (especially mothers who display narcissistic tendencies).
Reading up on these matters will not cure you, but it will could make you aware of just how badly you were manipulated by either one or both of your parents. Many pastors, priests and evangelists, if truth ever be told, could now fit one or more of many different types of neuroses, with labels such as
being bi-polar (or manic-depressive), narcissistic, pre-psychotic, etc.
There is actually no need for labels. All neuroses, from mild to psychotic, is simply a manifestation of having suffered severe trauma that overloaded the defence systems of and individual. As I have mentioned before, (a la Janov,
and other researchers who are now realising this as well), this pain or trauma that I speak of, can happen in the womb, during birth, as a baby, a toddler, an onwards to adulthood.
Simply not having your needs met as a baby, or being left in a room to cry by yourself, or being smacked, shushed, shaken, or -prevented in any way from crying your pain out, is painful to our beings. This is what causes neuroses.
Neuroses is the defence mechanism, the act-out, the crutch, the coping mechanism, and it takes on almost any form such as smoking, drinking heavily, overeating, talking endlessly, doing crime, developing or clinging to a crazy idea such as a belief system, even physical maladies, also ADD, Alzheimers, and many more. The system is overloaded, under attack from the inside. We cope by acting out, ……….. and praying.
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I couldn’t care less how fundies got that way, any more than I care why stupid people act stupidly, but I would tend to get out of the way of an out of control cement truck going downhill with the brakes off.
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Broer Fanie, ek probeer uitvind wat dit is wat julle so seker van jul saak maak, ( ok ek lieg ek wil uitvind dat ons dieselfde dink en is ), en ek vertsaan die “ideation” ook soos jy (dink ek), – die korteks het ‘n filtreer sisteem wat gedagtes verhoed om in jou bewussyn in te kom en volgens jou is die metode wat gebruik word om ander verdoeselde gedagtes deur te laat sodat die die persoon nie bewus raak van die pyngedagtes nie.
Die verskil kan dalk wees oor die bewoording van wat die pyngedagtes is, ek lei af jy praat nie net van fisiese pyn nie, kan ek daarna verwys as die metafisiese sug (primal scream)? Is dit die enigste of eerste “sug” van die heelal en die mens en al die ander pyn net ‘n variassie op dit?
As dit so is hoe sou jy die metafiese sug bewoord of “wat is dit?”
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He, he. Sien jy Verifanie, soos ek geseg het – die ou rook sy sokkies. Ek wonder soms of hy self verstaan wat hy skryf.
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Holyshmoly, thanks for the great music.
Malherbe, ek gaan tog ‘n antwoord gee op Johann se skrywe, maar dit sal hopelik byval vind by almal. Daar is soveel om te verduidelik, indien ons mense wil help, anders word dit net ‘n kwessie van is…..issie…..is…..issie…..is
…..issie…..ens.
Die antwoord, deel 1
Johann, ek moet aanneem dat jy moontlik ‘n boek gelees het met die titel “The Primal Scream”. Die boek was geskryf in 1969 deur Dr. Arthur Janov, wie per toeval die ontdekking gemaak het dat baie van ons as lewende wesens, rondloop met soms ontsaglike pyn, beide emotioneel en fisies, maar dat hierdie pyn toegekelder word. Hy het met verdere navorsing bewys dat hierdie pyn vrygestel kan word, indien dit herleef word deur ‘n individu, en hetsy onder ideale omstandighede.
“Primal” beteken eerste, en het niks met metafisika uit te waai nie. Die “scream” verwys slegs na die heel eerste ding wat Janov waargeneem het by een van sy pasiente. Ons as mense, hetsy baba of volwassene, het ‘n reeks emosionele reaksies, vanaf diep ween of huil en treurigheid, tot by woedende uitbarsting en geskreeu van oordonderende woede.
Soos ek alreeds genoem het, ons eerste brein wat ontwikkel gedurende die eerste trimester, is die reptiel brein, of viscera. Kom ons noem dit die “first line”. Die tweede brein wat begin om te ontwikkel gedurende die tweede trimester, is die emotionele brein, of limbiese stelsel. Dit is dan “second line”. Dan volg die intellektuele brein, of neo-cortex, (new cortex), wat ons denkende brein is. Dit heet “third line”
***I am not going to cite research references. These can all be obtained
by simply reading either the blog, or any books of Dr. Arthur Janov. It is pure science, no less. (arthurjanov.com – click on “Janov’s reflections on the human condition”)
A pregnant women who either smokes, drinks, does drugs, gets beaten, is depressed, has no hope of financial help, lives alone, her husband/partner having left her, or any one of the above, will impart serious “first line” pain/trauma to the foetus inside her. The pain will register deeply within the foetus, where it will do most damage because of the foetus’ undeveloped defence system.
A horrible protracted birth will also impart horrendous pain to the baby, whose body, as per the evolutionary continuum, will immediately start screaming and wailing once it is breathing. If this crying/screaming is prevented, and if the baby/toddler/youngster was not allowed to cry and scream as she grew, the child of three or four years old, will “throw temper tantrums”.
How many of us have either been a victim or a witness, when a belt is taken
to a youngster that “throws a tantrum”? (Why do teenagers and adults commit suicide?)
Traumatic pain stays in the body, becoming a powerful force that wants out at all costs. It is an energy, albeit an unpleasant energy, always
pushing upwards, constantly knocking. Alas, parents, teachers and others do not allow us to use our built-in tool kit, i.e. our emotions and feelings.
Part 2 to follow…..
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Voorspoed Verifanie, voorspoed. Ek sal vir jou bid.
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Die antwoord deel 2…
Our built-in tool kit is actually “the expression of emotions and feelings”. Simple fact is, that it was always our feelings that were repressed. Btw, depression is not a feeling, it is a state of being. It means that all of one’s feelings/emotions have been repressed, leading to well…… depression.
If one is sad, one is still alive. One can cry, feel the sadness, If you’re not allowed to feel sad, you will become depressed. Same with anger, and other
feelings. A deep and extended cry, when one cries about the actual situation that caused the pain, is the most wonderful thing that can happen to any human. Note that the crying must be connected to the original trauma, otherwise it is not cathartic as it should be.
We can relive trauma from our past, connecting with the awful hurt, expel it through our emotions, and heal ourselves. Unfortunately, this has to be done with the help of a very experienced and highly trained therapist. This is a therapy that Dr. Arthur Janov has developed and honed to near perfection over a period of 47 years at the Primal Centre in Los Angeles.
Interestingly, patients who went there for therapy, who were actually religious, or had other ideations, lost all their ideas about religion/gods/angels/devils, and/or other crazy ideas, often without it having ever been discussed or one word even mentioned about it.
A fully feeling and connected human being, has no antisocial leanings, no inkling to “do unto others”, nor to control, exploit or abuse anyone. He/she feels no need to pray to or worship any gods or deities, and can allow their children to express all their feelings and emotions, and do so by true evolutionary instinct alone.
*****Dr. Arthur Janov has just been invited by the National Institute of Mental Health in the US to come and discuss and share his knowledge and research with them. This is a great breakthrough for humans at large, since mainstream psychology/psychiatry has failed us hopelessly. Alas, it will still take a thousand years to have any effect on a crazy planet. Too many crazy ideas, bibles, religions, churches, evangelists, cults, con-men, tricksters, drug dealers, drug addicts, greedy bastards, fucked up great grandparents, grandparents, parents, children, teachers…… also military institutions, sick governments, politicians …….and all the millions who are in total denial… !!
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Haha Malherbe, dankie baie. Mag jy ook ryklik geseen word vir jou gristelike en voorbeeldige offerande.
***Die jong dogtertjie is besig om te sing: “Jesus is lief vir seuntjies, en vir dogtertjies, en al die fokken hasies” …..
Die ma is geskok, en se: Nee skattie, dit is “Al die volk en nasies”
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Malherbe, apropos of your comment:
You know, all I can do is try, As the saying goes: “Perhaps there is still one light on upstairs”
At times I really feel very sorry for people who suffer so much, as you saw on those poor women’s faces in the video about that bastard Popoff. ( I wish he would pop off) He is back in the game of fucking lonely, lost people again. Can’t stop the devil now can you?
Yes, at times I get terribly pissed off at godiots, but they are really victims.
Victims of victims of victims, going back generations. Many or perhaps most of them had religion forced down their throats at such a young age – just as I had – and they feel totally trapped, helpless, hopeless, unless they keep focusing on jesus or the gotte.
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Very true and unselfish comment Veri. You’re a better person than I. Suppose I should be greatful that by some miracle, I have discarded of the shackles of religion. Others are not that fortunate…
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Lyk my Johann is ‘n fan van die psycho analytic school of thought. Ek weet nie hoeveel mens se onder bewussyn mens se gedrag kan beinvloed nie, maar ek dink nogsteeds dat wat Darwin gese het baie meer waar is as Freud se teorie. Die mens reageer defnitief nog baie op instink. Wat wel waar is dat as mens droom kom al jou onder bewustelikke gedagtes na vore. Jy heroep die wereld waarbinne jy leef in jou slaap. Ek vermoed dat as ‘n mens oor sekere dinge worry word dit ook deel van jou onderbewuste. Hoe meer van ‘n waarskynlikheid iets is, hoe groter is die vrees dat dit met jou sal gebeur. So jy droom daarvan, dan gebeur dit! Die rede dat dit baie keer gebeur is oordat dit hoogs waarskynlik is.So op ‘n mate word ‘n mens se drome waar. Veral jou nagmerries . As iemand jou bang maak met ‘n spinnekop as jy nog klein is, dan sal jy heelwaarskynlik ‘n vrees he vir spinnekoppe as jy groot is eendag. Daardie vrees is nie ‘n gedagte wat in jou kop woon nie maar dit is in gewire om jou te beskerm. ons breine beskerm ons teen die buite wereld deur verse. Ons oer voorouers wat in Afrika gebly het sou baat gevind het daarby om vrese vir sekere goed te he. As een van jou groep se mense deur ‘n mamba gepik word en doodgaan sou die ander defnitief ‘n vrees daarvoor gehad het. Die mens as ‘n spesie het ook hierdie ingewirede vrese. Spinnekoppe, slange, krokodille en groot roofdiere is defnitief baie vreesaanjaend vir die mens. Dit beskerm die spesie! So dit is nie regtig gedagtes wat onderbewustellik in ‘n mens se kop is nie maar dit meer ‘n ingewirede ding. Ek glo baie defnitief eerder Darwin se teorie as Freud sn.
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LAG SO BIETJIE LEKKER…..
In her US radio show, Dr. Ura Schlesinger said that, as an observant Orthodox Jew, homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned under any circumstance. Here is a response from a U.S citizen:
Dear Dr. Schlesinger,
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God’s Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination … I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God’s Laws and how to follow them.
Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can’t I own Canadians?
2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of Menstrual uncleanliness – Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord – Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should I ask the police to do it?
6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don’t agree. Can you settle this? Are there ‘degrees’ of abomination?
7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?
8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27. How should they die?
9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn’t we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
1I. I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I’m confident you can help.
Thank you again for reminding us that God’s word is eternal and unchanging.
Your adoring fan. James M. Kauffman, Ed.D. Professor Emeritus, Dept. Of Curriculum, Instruction, and Special Education, University of Virginia
P.S. It would be a damn shame if we couldn’t own a Canadian …..
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Broer Fanie, dankie vir die stimuleerende geskrif, ek het my misgis met die afrikaans vir “primal scream”, soos jy dit verduidelik lyk dit nie na dieselfde konsep nie. Die metafisiese sug het vir my ‘n wyer betekenis. (Ek was nie bewus van Janov se teorie nie, en ek is seker dat hy baie mense al gehelp het en dat dit vir baie mense werk.)
Met die metafisiese sug gaan dit oor die mens se “sug” om te weet wat agter alles is wat is. Dit het nie net te doen met die mens en sy probleme, (eintlik probleempies – wat hy dink hy het nie) en oor sy ou lewe wat so belangrik is nie, dit gaan oor ‘n heel groter prentjie wat dit beteken en wat dit is om “mens” te wees. En my tyd is op ek het nog komentaar te lewer oor die “A fully feeling and connected human being, has no antisocial leanings”, dit is “iets” wat mens kan in belangstel en ook iets om na te streef, want ek weet nie wat dit beteken nie. . .
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Adriaan, ek voel vir jou, sal dit nou lekker wees as jy jou persepssie kan “reset” en jou onbewuste kan uitvee (“Format”) en dan nuwe en skoon programme weer oplaai, van die wat JY wil hê. . ?
Vra die kundige op sielkunde of hy/sy jou kan help jy wil graag die geloofsprong maak en na wie kan jy gaan, sê net jy wil ook die ervaring hê wat jy nog nooit gehad het nie, sodat jy kan verstaan wat dit beteken. Dan kan jy terugstaan en tjill, want jy het nou alles gedoen wat jy hoef te doen.
Ek vra jou dit van die bodum van my hart af – doen dit jou tjiekensjt.
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Broer Fanie, “A fully feeling and connected human being” Ek wil dit wees, ek raak gedurig anti sosiaal as ek bv. Mallies se ontlasting en braaksel lees, hoe kan ek myself genees? Jy het die teorie verduidelik, nou kan ek dit maar probeer.
As jy dalk onthou waarna die woord “dualisme” wys, dan behoort dit maklik te wees om te verstaan dat mense ‘n “konsep” God in daai neo-korteks “skep”.
Dis dan dat daar verwys word na die mens is die skepper van sy eie God. Ek kan dit verstaan, maar hoekom stop mens daar, wat as “non-duality” ook bekyk word, hoe sou dinge dan gelyk het, ek verstaan dat kwantum fisisie tot gevolgtrekking gekom het dat “duality” is ‘n “myth”, wat dit ook al vir hulle beteken, maar as mens met non-duality “houding” jou persepsie verander, hoe sou dit gelyk het. . .?
Baie mense en Mallies getuig daaroor, het die konsep god probeer “worship” (eendag, wens ek, sal ons met daai woord by dieselfde plek uitkom – “worship”) en natuurlik het nugtere verstand ons almal seker daarvan laat weg draai. Ek kan dit ook verstaan, maar hoekom weer ‘n keer stop, hoekom gaan soek mens dan nie verder nie, want om te “glo” is bokant “rede”.
Ek weet ek kan dit vir jou so stel, want jy het al ‘n paadjie geloop.
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I might want to believe the moon is made of cheese and has a will of its own, and part of that will is going to send a multi flavoured cheese meteorite into my back garden so I needn’t bother to stock up on gouda, edam, cheddar or brie at PnP, but reason tells me that’s not likely to happen anytime soon. You might think that is an absurd example, but I have seen too many people’s lives messed up by the kind of religion that says, “God will provide” and “Thanks to God for helping me make it through another year”. These are examples of not just magical but short term thinking. It’s a denial of responsibility. If God is not providing, or if they’re going through a rough patch with even poorer prospects, they will look for scapegoats because this is part of their magical thinking. God’s plan is not working for some reason, they reason. It can’t be God’s fault, so it must be someone else’s.
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Johann, miskien kan jy vir ons weer ‘n gediggie skryf. Ons lag tog te lekker.
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“ .. ek verstaan dat kwantum fisisie (sic) tot gevolgtrekking gekom het dat “duality” is ‘n “myth”, ..”
Johann, los liewer enige skrywe oor die wetenskap uit, want jy is ‘n aap op diè gebied. Gaan lees bietjie oor Thomas Young se interferensie eksperiment om jou kennis oor die kwantum teorie te verbreed. Jy het per ongeluk raakgeskiet deurdat daar wel fisici was (en is) (Einstein was die eerste een) wat sê dualiteit te wyte is aan die feit dat ons nie op die kwantumvlak kan “sien” wat aangaan nie. D.w.s die kwantum teorie is nog nie volledig beskryf nie. Louis de Brogli het gepostuleer, en dit is later eksperimenteel bewys, dat nie net elektromagnetiese golwe partikel èn golf-eienskappe openbaar nie, maar enige partikel ook golf-eienskappe het. Die huidige gevoel onder die meerderheid fisici is dat die kwantum teorie onvolledig is, maar dat dualisme ‘n mite is, is nonsens.
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Look at this nitwit convert to Islam. http://youtu.be/AY_NWPRWGMk
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Trying again. If it doesn’t work you need to click through. http://youtu.be/AY_NWPRWGMk
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Who is this woman? She mentions she is a previous Miss SA? Quite strange that she has to repeat everything in Arabic during her conversion. One would think that Allah would understand English.
Just goes to show that all religions have irrationality in common.
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Silly you, God’s been an Arab all along. I wonder what she thinks she will get in the afterlife, does she believe seven gorgeous young Arabs will come thundering along on horseback to relieve her of her recycled virginity when she finally gets to Allah’s paradise? Why wait that long when you can get gangraped and thrown in jail in this lifetime, right next to a mosque in Gaza. Typical old narcissist who’s been dumped by too many white guys who see through her delusional, egocentred bullshit, now she thinks she will hit it off with the Arabs.
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Batshit crazy! She strikes me as the hippie type. The way she sits, talks, gestures etc. From the arms of one god to the arms of the next. I bet you if she hasn’t tried it yet, she will be a Buddhist soon enough.
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That’s putting it kindly. If there isn’t a political agenda she won’t get involved.
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Koel Diek vir ‘n oomblik het ek die gevoelgekry jy praat “af” na my toe en toe vertel jy my weereens dat die arme wetenskaplikes kan nie agter kom wat gaan aan nie. . . . (Teoriee kom en teoriee gaan♪ ♪)
Wat betekenisvol is is wat beteken dit…? Wat maak dit saak inelkgeval – soos julle atties wat “glo” (sonder bewyse) dat as jy sterf dan is dit dieselfde soos dit was voor jy gebore is – jy weet niks . . .?
Wat beteken ‘dualisme” en “non-dualisme” vir die mens ? En nie vir die biologiese masjien nie?
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Tja, en jou byyyybel bly konstant, ne Johannie? Ek dink jy’s effe dronkgespring na al die gode.
Onthou (weereens): onbegrip kan nie dien as bewys van die bonatuurlike nie. Lyk my jy sukkel maar om hierdie basiese beginsel te snap.
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Science rules! Wetenskap is wat is. Daar kan altyd menings verskille wees, maar feite bly feite.
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“Science rules!”
Is so Adriaan, maar nie in die koppe van die godbots en onse paaivreter nie. “Niemand weet wat gravitasie is nie”, en “dualisme bestaan nie in die kwantum nie”, om net twee voorbeelde van laasgenoemde se begrip van die wetenskap te noem. Die wetenskap berus op bewyse d.m.v. eksperimente. Paaivreter het nou nog nie enige bewys van sy gode se bestaan gebring nie. En dan verwag hy ons moet so delusional soos hy word deur ‘n “geloofsprong” te maak. Nie maklik nie.
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Religion is a dangerous drug and every place of worship and every religious icon should carry a warning: “Religion can make you even more delusional than you already are and can totally destroy your life.” You get people who are moderately religious to start off with, but when the promises fail to materialise the same way the ANC’s promises don’t – not for nothing did Jacob Zuma say the ANC will rule till Jesus comes – the godbots go into obsessive mode, seeking out esoteric shops to damn them for their false idols and their blasphemy, going into peoples homes and telling them they will go to hell if they have vases with dragons on them, get rid of that little buddha in the flower tub, you need a crucifix in every room, then you realise that you are dealing with someone who has to hit rock bottom before they come to their senses, and they are going to take you with them on their crazy crusade. It’s sad when it happens to a friend but you get to the point where you have to cut your losses and walk away.
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Put differently: Buddhism isn’t fascist enough. There must always be an element of pain and suffering, of sadism and masochism.
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Make no mistake, Buddhism has plenty of that!
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Mallies – “onbegrip kan nie dien as bewys van die bonatuurlike ” Eerstens weet jy nie wat die woord bonatuurlike na toe wys nie, tweedens as “bewussyn” nie bewys kan word deur Koel Diek se wetenskap nie, beteken dit dan dat dié nie bestaan nie, ek dog ons was al hier oor en daar het geen verandering in jou “neo-korteks” plaas gevind nie. . . .?
“verwag hy ons moet so delusional soos hy word deur ‘n “geloofsprong” te maak. Nie maklik nie” . . . .Kan julle dit nie eens doen vir een misrabele dag in jul lewens nie, dit wat julle aan glo het so ‘n sterk houvas op julle , verbind en verblind, en natuurlik is die afgode wat julle “worswhip” verskrik dat as julle die geloofsprong maak gaan julle oë oopgaan en die afgode se delusionaliteit aan julle bekend gemaak word, waarom waarom kan julle nie hoor nie, ek was waar julle nou is, ek het my eie konsep god probeer “worship” en dit het nie gewerk nie want dit is vals, maar ek het nie daar opgehou nie, ek het verder gaan soek. Moenie nou die heeltyd terug gaan na jul eie braaksel en dan nog verder daarop braak nie.
En Broer Fanie het nou verander in vinnige Fanie (terug grot toe), het julle niks verstaan wat hy geskryf het nie? En wie kan sê dat gravitase nie delusional is nie, miskien is die plekke waar ruimte tyd gebuig is ‘n vergaderplek van energie wat ons na verwys as planete, en behalwe Koel Diek weet niemand nie.
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What’s this now, gravity is a myth, the earth sucks? Johann, you lack focus, your mind jumps all over the place.
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Have pity Holy. He’s got a drinking problem. His family should implement an intervention.
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Drinking too much is often a sign of depression. There are meds that control the physical craving for alcohol. Once the physical addiction is under control the psychological issues can be addressed – in fact, once the addiction is controlled, the depression can disappear by itself because alcohol is a central nervous depressant.
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Sobering advice to Johann. Far better chance of curing him this way than praying for him.
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Ek sal enige tyd met jou praat wanneer jy sober is Johannie. Slaap dit eers af ou maat.
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Ek het nie altyd die tyd om prentjies te teken nie, en nou i.p.v. om te antwoord is daar net ‘n beroering daar op die grondboontjie gallery.
As mens stjoepit wil wees dan moet jy maar safver.
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Stem saam – mens suffer seker veral as mens nie eens “suffer” en “stupid” kan spel nie. In die land van die godiote is die Dronkjohannie koning.
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Keep walking, Johannie Walker.
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Johann, jy het al hierdie fantastiese feite voor jou. Hoekom strewe jy so na die bonatuurlikke? Jy wil gefassineerd wees met goed waarvan jy nie veel weet nie nl. Die bonatuurlikke. Daar is ‘n seding wat se dat die metafisiese van vandag die wetenskap van more is.
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Adriaan so af en toe kom daar iets van jou af wat my weer hoop gee, die feite waarvan jy praat is die mense wat ‘n “lyk” ondersoek, m.a.w. dis ‘n dooie ding en dit hou hulle net aan die raai en al klink dit nou baie slim, gaan daar nie veel van kom nie, hoe vêrder die wetenskaplikes krap hoe meer vrae ontstaan daar – ek verkies eerder om aan die kant van die lewendiges te bly, en ek weet wat ons doen is om te “lewe”, maar wat dit beteken is meer belangrik as om te probeer “bewys” dan ander mense verkeerd is, – ek sou eerder “aan” wou beweeg asom heeltyd andermense te blameer vir wat ek self aan skuldig is. (M. a.w. dat ek die doel van my lewe mis omdat ek glo dat ek verwyder is van God, mense verwys daarna as sonde – mis jou doel).
En wat ek lees van jou en die ander daar op die grondboontjie gallery is “hulp krete”. Wat in jul onderbewussyn onderdruk word.
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